China closed loop

[dirtybanger]

The prices on closed loop systems continue to drop, and as of writing this I can get a 120g jacketed column system without CRC for 300 by one of the Scrabble bag named importers (it must be popular to name your company after your captcha answer).

From an engineers standpoint, I see pipes, valves, and gages, connected via compressed gaskets or threaded fittings. Assuming the flanges were not beaten up, the gaskets aren't porous, and the threaded fittings seal, the item should work as intended, even if the shop monkeys forgot thread tape, I can redo that.

If I'm not chasing features like splatter platters, jacketed collection pots, reclaim pumps, chiller coils, windowed vessels, etc, what am I missing out on by not going with a tamisium or best value branded unit? Just a cool keychain and sticker? I really don't need the price of tech support baked in, I paid attention in school, and it's unfair to ask me to pay to support those that didn't pay attention, or for a warranty worth the paper it's printed on.

And does anyone have any idea how much solvent is lost in each cycle, between pump down and what is drawn off in mother liquor? What can I expect for operating costs, aside from my passive energy sources like cold and hot?

 

[Graywolf]

Easy to build your own:

15.1 The History of the Terpenator According to Gospel - GrayWolf's Lair

Success has many fathers, while failure is often a bastard child, so stories abound about how closed loop BHO extraction got started. Truth is also […]

graywolfslair.com

15.2 Lil Terp - GrayWolf's Lair

During the time frame that I introduced the Mk III, I introduced the Lil Terp Passive extractor, which was based on the Mk III design, but […]

graywolfslair.com

How much LPG you use, depends on the process. You can pour early into jars for burping and isolate, you can make cotton candy, both of which "waste" LPG, or you can pump most of it off and make FECO.

 

[DemonTrich]

You can buy used equipment for pennies on the dollar nowadays. Most cant resell what they have and just scrap it. Sometimes you can find it for almost free. Just have to know where to look.

 

[dirtybanger]

Easy to build your own:

15.1 The History of the Terpenator According to Gospel - GrayWolf's Lair

Success has many fathers, while failure is often a bastard child, so stories abound about how closed loop BHO extraction got started. Truth is also […]

graywolfslair.com

15.2 Lil Terp - GrayWolf's Lair

During the time frame that I introduced the Mk III, I introduced the Lil Terp Passive extractor, which was based on the Mk III design, but […]

graywolfslair.com

How much LPG you use, depends on the process. You can pour early into jars for burping and isolate, you can make cotton candy, both of which "waste" LPG, or you can pump most of it off and make FECO.

I said above that I paid attention in school, and didn't need tech support baked in the process, well, you were the professor in many of my classes. Twenty(?) years ago, when you and foaf were prototyping these, and tinkering with active systems, I was soaking up everything you guys did, and envying the toys you created.

Twenty years ago I wanted to perform your ashtray polishing chemistry to recover precious cannabinoids. It's still on my bucket list, but as a flex now.

Thanks for sharing all you shared, and for keeping the lights on at GWL, the new theme shocked me, that place had a certain familiarity, and I was shocked to see it was different.

You can buy used equipment for pennies on the dollar nowadays. Most cant resell what they have and just scrap it. Sometimes you can find it for almost free. Just have to know where to look.

That's was my original thoughts, that I'd find one that somebody tried to run without vacuuming the non-condensables out, or just couldn't understand phase change and how to move the solvent, came with leaky seals, maybe unhappy with the size, etc, and that I'd find one on the second hand market fairly priced. Like you said, it's about knowing where to look. Marketplace and Craigslist have offers. The commercial units are a little more than I need regardless of savings, and personal sized units show up, but for some goofy reason, I see a $400 column, a $150 vacuum pot/pump combo, and a $30 heat mat priced insanely at $1100 or trade for two jet skis and trailer. I definitely don't want to buy one from the guy that threw in the towel because his garden went south after he bought a used column with hlvd all over it either.

 

[DemonTrich]

You never use the seals/gaskets from a used closed loop. Even the clamps id swap for new.

 

[DemonTrich]

Vac ovens are very cheap, a few hundred bucks. There are $500,000 extraction skids that are being sold for 50k-100k now. Its crazy, 10yrs ago, equipment fetched a very premium price. Now it's basically scrap $ at this point.

 

[Graywolf]

I said above that I paid attention in school, and didn't need tech support baked in the process, well, you were the professor in many of my classes. Twenty(?) years ago, when you and foaf were prototyping these, and tinkering with active systems, I was soaking up everything you guys did, and envying the toys you created.

Twenty years ago I wanted to perform your ashtray polishing chemistry to recover precious cannabinoids. It's still on my bucket list, but as a flex now.

Thanks for sharing all you shared, and for keeping the lights on at GWL, the new theme shocked me, that place had a certain familiarity, and I was shocked to see it was different.

That's was my original thoughts, that I'd find one that somebody tried to run without vacuuming the non-condensables out, or just couldn't understand phase change and how to move the solvent, came with leaky seals, maybe unhappy with the size, etc, and that I'd find one on the second hand market fairly priced. Like you said, it's about knowing where to look. Marketplace and Craigslist have offers. The commercial units are a little more than I need regardless of savings, and personal sized units show up, but for some goofy reason, I see a $400 column, a $150 vacuum pot/pump combo, and a $30 heat mat priced insanely at $1100 or trade for two jet skis and trailer. I definitely don't want to buy one from the guy that threw in the towel because his garden went south after he bought a used column with hlvd all over it either.

Thanks you for the recognition and kind thoughts brother and pleased you learned something from it! It was a good retirement project for me and I learned a bunch from it too, besides all the fun!

 

[Chefdave]

Vac ovens are very cheap, a few hundred bucks. There are $500,000 extraction skids that are being sold for 50k-100k now. Its crazy, 10yrs ago, equipment fetched a very premium price. Now it's basically scrap $ at this point.

Yeah, I don't think most people on pheno hunter, understands the legal commercial market situation at the moment, impossible to make money, unless massive, with the ability to produce flower at 100 bucks a pound( only possible with greenhouse, super automated, and in a greenhouse climate suitable state, I see equipment of all sorts almost free, compared to cost at pandemic times. ) I feel for many medium and small canna operators, who have lost everything, and the ones on their way. I'm hoping federal loophole with 2018 farm bill goes away soon which I think it will, maybe this will drive the wholesale price of all cannabis flower, concentrate, etc up to where the smaller guys can carve out a living farming, America's backbone!

 

[DemonTrich]

The medical aspect of the mj scene was awesome for many many years. I did pretty fn well from 2008-2020. Then legalization took hold (like here in michigan). 2yrs after legalization passed and brick n mortar storefronts were abundant, that pushed 90% of every small grower (the ones who paved the road to legalization) shut down their grows. I only know of a few small growers who still do this (again speaking of michigan). Why would I wanna grow when I can get lbs for 650-800 of primo flower. Its cheaper to sling acquired vs grow.

 

[Chefdave]

The medical aspect of the mj scene was awesome for many many years. I did pretty fn well from 2008-2020. Then legalization took hold (like here in michigan). 2yrs after legalization passed and brick n mortar storefronts were abundant, that pushed 90% of every small grower (the ones who paved the road to legalization) shut down their grows. I only know of a few small growers who still do this (again speaking of michigan). Why would I wanna grow when I can get lbs for 650-800 of primo flower. Its cheaper to sling acquired vs grow.

I can buy for 350 to 400 for primo greenhouse out of San Diego. Costs me more to grow not including my time and labor!

 

[DemonTrich]

This is for AA indoor (bigs/smalls mixes). AAA indoor is 900-1000 (bigs). Variety of strains 10-15 to choose from.

 

[dirtybanger]

Variety of strains 10-15 to choose from.

This is the kicker. Twenty five years ago, you were selling weed. Today your selling options. If all you have is weed, people are going to gravitate to where they have options.

When Michigan allowed caregiver overages, the system was nice for both consumer and producer. There was a local grower that did really nice work with subcool strains on Detroits east side. A bud tender used to hit me up when that cat made drops, and I was never disappointed.

The 3-400 outdoor from Cali and rado doesn't help either.

Or the alt noids.

Or the farm bill stuff.

Or a whole generation of smokers trained by social media that weed is supposed to be perfectly spherical Grinch terds ground up by mechanical trimmers.

You never use the seals/gaskets from a used closed loop. Even the clamps id swap for new.

Personally, on a used model, I wouldn't trust any consumables anyway, but the mention of this has me realize I've never seen any data on the expected life of seals. The education never ends. Thanks for that thought!

 

[Bullfrog]

Yeah, I don't think most people on pheno hunter, understands the legal commercial market situation at the moment

I'd suspect that lack of understanding is more a lack of care. I know I couldn't care any less than I do.